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The conversation begins before the series of questions, in an
interview amidst a slew of cameras. It will be
filmed for the Round Table on Cuban television and
while the technicians and cameramen improvise the
set, Ignacio Ramonet is relaxed and even joking
about the overwhelming event of his intense One
Hundred Hours with Fidel which reflects almost
all of the journalistic humanity, on the one side
and, on the other, the political framework which,
undoubtedly, separates the practice of our
profession, that I, once, would have liked the
Comandante en Jefe.
“You are greedy; you haven’t left anything for your
colleagues. Not even an hour.” And he laughs and
almost excuses himself, and, later, seriously we
commented on the last editorial news. “He is resting
in Spain, the first edition and almost the second.
We move on to the third which will be the one Cuban
readers will have”, he comments. English, Portuguese
and French versions sell out in the bookstores while
preparing contracts in other languages. Ramonet just
came from Japan where he signed an agreement for the
translation and publication of the book in that
country and has information of three South Korean
publishers fighting over the first edition in that
language. In the United States, 40,000 copies were
issued and the book is successfully sold in popular
circles.
While he speaks, his expression is one of amazement.
He is aware that the book has been enormously lucky
in spite of the international campaign unleashed
before it left the presses. It celebrates in
advance, the sinking [sic] not only of One
hundred hours with Fidel, but the professional
credibility of the author.
But we will deal with that below because now the
lights are set, cameras are rolling and,
unfortunately we do not have one hundred hours only
30 minutes to talk, before he rushes out to an
intense program of presentations in half the world,
beginning with Cuba.
ONE HUNDRED HOURS WITH FIDEL
—Last May 16
you presented the first edition of the book which
had 700 pages. A few months later, this second
edition, has exactly 800 pages. Shouldn’t this new
edition be called More than one hundred hours
with Fidel?
—Actually, the hours I spent with him are the same.
What has been added between the first and second
editions are the hours Fidel has employed working
over the same questions. The difference between
these two editions is that he was only able to
rapidly glance over the first due to a lack of time
because of his responsibilities. In the presentation
of the first edition, he himself realized, on
re-reading the book, that it was necessary to add
details that only he could do.
—Not only
details. There are also important new notes.
—They are lengthened details. For example, I’m going
to mention three or four which were added and that
were important, because, as you say, between the
first and second edition there is almost a one
hundred page difference, without counting the
multitude of modifications he has made, more so in
style.
The first version had a more conversational style
while in the new edition he wanted to give it a more
written character because, logically, it is a book.
—What
modifications are there? What added?
—Many modifications have been made in the first part
where he improves the description of his childhood
in the Oriente countryside during the 20s and 30s.
There is an imbalance in the first edition that was
my fault because I asked him many questions about
his father and very few about his mother. Now he has
added some very personal paragraphs, very emotional,
about his mother that is not mentioned or written
about in previous books.
“Another important addition is in the chapter about
the October Crisis where he added his answers to
letters written to Nikita Khrushchev. They are not
unpublished, but little-known around the world. They
were added so people could better understand the
circumstances around one of the most serious crises
the world has ever lived through in the last 50
years”.
—The letters
written to Saddam Hussein were absolutely
unpublished and appear here for the first time.
—When we talk of the crisis of the war in Iraq he
told me: “I even sent a message to Saddam Hussein,
calling on him to demonstrate that he did not have
weapons of mass destruction and prevent an attack”.
That appears in the first edition.
In this version, two letters he sent after the Iraqi
invasion of Kuwait, during the early 90s are
included in toto.
“Also, this is the most complete version of the coup
against Chavez in Venezuela in April of 2002”.
—You had a
great scoop because it is the first time Fidel gives
a detailed explanation of the events of the coup in
Venezuela and the return of President Hugo Chavez to
Miraflores.
—Exactly. In the first edition it was understood
that he had participated but it was lacking more
facts. While here are details of the telephone
conversations he had with Chavez, with different
generals, etc., and it is evident how he lived
through this coup d'etat. I think
that his intervention was decisive to changing the
course of events in Venezuela in those days.
—You have
insisted that this is a book of interviews not of
interrogations. What, exactly, do you mean?
—Many persons in Europe, mostly in Spain, have told
me: “You are not very critical, you don’t ask him
disturbing questions”. I have answered that here are
almost all the questions on points that can be
discussed and some are controversial in this long
experience of almost 50 years of the Cuban
Revolution. Only they are not made aggressively or
as an interrogation. Interrogations are for the
police. A journalist does not interrogate. A
journalist asks questions and the responsibilities
for the answers are of the interviewee.
“I wanted to have a conversation. I have said it
often: he never set any condition. He let himself be
taken towards everywhere I wanted to lead the
interview. It never occurred to me to make an
interrogation because I knew that any question,
regardless of its delicate nature, he would answer
with calm and weighty arguments. And that is what
happened.
“Any person who reads this book without a formed
opinion either in favor or against the Revolution,
will find, in Fidel’s answers, a reasoning”.
—In my notes
the day the first edition was presented at the
Convention Palace, there is a phrase by Fidel: “It
was not an easy interview although the weasels have
made that accusation”. You were also accused of
making a false interview, that the photographs were
trick shots and other things. Why was this reaction
produced?
—In Europe there is a tradition that, before a book
is placed on sale, if it is interesting, the
journalists asked the editors for an extract to be
published before it is released in the bookstores. A
great Spanish newspaper (El Pais) asked the editor's
authorization. They published a large fragment of
the last chapter, XXVI that is called “What happens
after Fidel”. The article had a photograph of the
interview where Fidel and I were seen talking. Then
he was talking about what could happen when he no
longer had responsibility for Cuba. The minute that
fragment came out hostile criticisms began.
“The first thing that was said was: ‘it was a false
interview. Ramonet was unable to interview Fidel
Castro because he has been dead for weeks.’ Second:
‘It is false because part of the answers are taken
from speeches’. And thirdly: ‘Because the photograph
is a trick one that has a sitting Ramonet added,
sitting in a chair, with another, at another time
that includes Fidel’”
“Before the book came out there was already a
debate. The press, especially in Miami, began to
speculate. They headlined: “Journalist publishes a
false interview with Fidel Castro”, and that kind of
thing. When the book came out they realized that it
was very difficult to invent a 700-page interview.
It would be an extraordinarily difficult thing to
do. And on the other hand, I always explained that
Fidel gave me authorization
—in some questions where the answer was “I have
already answered that in such and such an article or
speech” — to reproduce these ideas, that he was on
top of it and revised it in principle.
 “The
photographs were obviously real. They could be
contrasted with a series of documentaries for
television, with seven hours of filming that was
broadcast on many European channels before the book
came out. “In Spain the book was sold in large
stores and bookshops accompanied by a DVD with an
hour of the interview. There, Fidel is seen giving
the answers that appeared in the newspaper. There
are no tricks.
“All these attacks that don’t surprise me because
every time you mention Cuba there is always
controversy and then they end up falling flat. The
book released has been very successful”.
—But the
attacks were not only verbal, but there were also
reprisals. At that time you were fired from La voz
de Galicia, together with Ramón Chao and the
newspaper director.
—That’s right. The mere publication of the interview
with Fidel caused me the loss of the newspaper
contract; a paper where I wrote a weekly chronicle.
Although they knew well that I was working on the
book since had I worked on the project for three
years. Ramón Chao also was left out
of the paper because he supported me. Of course, it
was a reprisal.
—Marvels of
a free press.
—These things happen all the time. They accuse Cuba
of a diversity of abuses but, in fact, I have been
abused because I have been a victim of censure,
especially in Spain simply for doing my work as a
journalist. This is a book of a journalist. Is this
book necessary? Yes, it is necessary. There is much
talk about Fidel Castro and Cuba, all the time, but
they are never heard.
“In gatherings with readers in Spain, I have talked
to people who may not necessarily have a favorable
opinion of the Cuban Revolution and have told me:
‘At last we have seen the arguments of Fidel Castro
and they are solid’.
“Fidel Castro is the most censured person in the
mass media, they mention him but his words are not
heard. That is not right. I think that it is normal
for a journalist to give the right of speech to
someone who doesn’t want to be heard.”
—Fidel has
been working very hard on this book, before and
after the operation. Have you been aware of the
rewriting?
—We have been in constant communication, through the
assistance of Fidel. Since the day of its
presentation when he committed himself to check the
book completely because he hadn’t gone as deep as he
wanted. He spent time on this task with a lot of
energy, with a lot of enthusiasm and I, of course,
was in contact. We had planned to present the book
for his birthday and I was to come before to work
together on the advance of that correction, of that
rewriting.
“I hope his effort spent on the book was not a cause
of his fatigue, of his illness. I hope not because I
would feel guilty. I also know why he has said it,
that as soon as he began recovery he took up the
book with energy. Although his situation was of
care, such as anyone who has undergone an operation
like the one he had. He wanted to finish the book at
all costs to have it ready for the Non-Aligned
Movement”.
—It was a
special present for the Heads of State…
—This effort was admirable. It was proof of the
character of a person. Although he was physically
diminished – by the operation, of course – he
devoted his energy to work very seriously. Anyone
can compare the first edition with the second and
notice the many modifications he made. He fulfilled
his promise and the book was out in time.
—When and
how did you learn that your interviewee was
submitted to a delicate operation and that his life
was in danger?
—Imagine, at the time I was pretty isolated. I was
trekking in the Alps with my wife and children. He
had broken communications with the computer,
television and the telephone – well the telephone
no, now no one can live without it. But I was in
such a high and isolated place the cell phone did
not connect. I was walking along a trail and,
miraculously, my telephone beeped. It was Radio
Caracol, in Bogota, Colombia and they: “Cuban
television has informed that Castro has been
operated on. What are your comments about this?”
That is how I found out. I ran out to find a
television and I saw our friend Carlitos Valenciaga
– French television and all the televisions around
the world were broadcasting the proclamation he read
–. I was working greatly like many people around the
globe.
—I was in
Spain on July 31. At first the press reacted with
morbid fascination and then with amazement: they
couldn’t understand why there was so much calm and
tranquility in Cuba. Then came an avalanche of
opinions from the “transitionologists”. Where you
surprised by the reaction of the Cuban people?
—Of course, I was not surprised. The best proof is
that I covered the subject in the introduction of
the book, something they have also criticized me for
frequently. If you remember, I say that many people
speculate about what will happen in Cuba when, for
any natural reason, Fidel is not here. Above all,
because they compare Cuba with what happened in the
Eastern European nations when the Soviet Union
collapsed. And I add in the introduction that they
are wrong. Nothing like this will happen in Cuba
because, simply, Cuba is not an eastern country
where soldiers of the Soviet Union brought the
revolution. It did not rise from the roots of these
societies although there were persons who wanted
this revolution. In Cuba, on the other hand the
Revolution was an endogenous phenomenon; it
developed here, linked to its history.
“On the other hand, no matter how much people
speculate about unrest here, the majority of the
population supports this system. When an accident of
health happens here, when, institutionally, there is
a provisional transition of responsibilities, what
happens is that we could predict what happens. I was
not surprised, as it did not surprise you and many
people. It was the most natural thing in the world.
“To speculate about the opposite, it comes from
people who are deceived by their own lies. They end
up believing their own lies and losing ability to
make an objective analysis, to see reality. This is
the country where, in 47 years, there have not been
popular insurrections, like those that occurred in
the Eastern countries. That is significant and
cannot be explained with an argument of repression.
In spite of repression, the people of Poland rose
up, in the German Democratic Republic, in Rumania
and Czechoslovakia. In Cuba the reaction of the
people has nothing to do with repression.
“The ‘transitionologists’ should read the book. At
one point Fidel asked me: ‘Are you talking about
transition?’ And I answer him: ‘Yes, of transition.
Talk to me about it’. And he discusses it in a most
natural manner. ‘In this country we have had to talk
about it since the beginning,’ he says. ‘Because
there have been 600 attempts on my life. Since the
beginning we have had to think what would happen if
I weren’t here’. The manner this transition would
follow is more than institutionalized. Therefore,
the surprise was for those who did not want to know
the reality.”
—Is it true
that you were a member of a “Castroist” cell in
Tangier?
—Not really a cell, because I created the group.
When I was a 12 or 13 year-old boy in 1956, I used
to go to a barber in Tangier. The barber was a man
who had been to Cuba many times; he was a Spaniard
very fond of the Island. The magazine he set out for
his clients was
Bohemia.
With curiosity I began to read
Bohemia
in its salmon-colored pages, the red chronicles
relating repressions of the dictatorship. One thing
led to another: I discovered the personality of
Fidel Castro, the 26th of July Movement.
The press did not report this yet. Cuba was not even
known. It was too far away for international
concerns. But, in the Institute I formed a small
group of Castro sympathizers and of the 26th
of July Movement. We had followed the kidnapping of
Fangio, about which little was said. We followed its
progress until the triumph of the Revolution which
was an event covered by the international press.
—Why have
you said that from an early age you sympathized with
this Revolution and no other?
—I lived in Tangier, Morocco and what interested me
as a child – like many people of my generation – was
decolonization. I was born in 1943. I do not belong
to the generation whose real battle was
fascism-antifascism. That was my parent’s
generation: my father participated in the Spanish
Civil War and my mother was a union militant.
“The central battle of my generation, during its
adolescence and early adulthood was
colonialism-anti-colonialism. Specially the
liberation of colonized countries. In the first
place, about Morocco that obtained independence in
1956 after an internal battle. And, also, Algeria, a
neighboring country where I have lived, that began
its struggle against colonialism in 1954. When Cuba
appeared in my life were in full swing with the war
in Algeria. And in my school, some of my classmates
were Algerian refugees in Tangier because of the
repression in their country.
“Within this context, what happened in Cuba we saw
it as a fight for liberation of one form of
colonialism, that in this case was imperialism or
neocolonialism. That is why the Cuban Revolution
seemed to us as something very original
— it wasn’t in the Soviet style nor did was
it like the Chinese revolution. It was and is unique
and emerged from an historical tradition, although
with Marxist-Leninist tendencies. It had the
importance of Marti that, at that time, I could not
identify and that gave it that gave its
characteristic roots with the liberation movement of
Latin America; that Fidel clearly explains in the
first chapter of the book. He says that the Cuban
Revolution is linked to the liberation of Latin
America and the wars of independence and is
inscribed along this route. And no other.”
—Today Ramonet knows more about me than I do
myself”, Fidel said. Is that true?
—No, not in the least. He says it because he is very
generous. I have only shared a few days in his long
life, in that conversation. I have tried show how I
see him, his daily professional life and tried to
write about it honestly and objectively. He is like
that, the way he is described in the book. There is
no duplicity, not one way one moment and another way
another moment. I think that if one sees him
regularly for a week or for ten days continuously,
you are absolutely aware that that’s the way he is,
without hidden or different, or contrary behaviors.
Of course, there are many people who know him better
than me because they have known him throughout the
years during his long life.
“The interest shown for the book is that, during
this long conversation, he talks about his life. A
life seen from within. The book almost seems like
the plot of a detective novel that is: How did this
boy from Biran become Fidel Castro? How did a boy
born in a small hamlet, that isn’t even a town, in a
rural environment and scarcely developed — without
electricity, without anything—, in a relatively
conservative family, educated in conservative
Catholic religious schools, how, I repeat, did this
boy become one of the main revolutionaries of the 20th
century? That is the mystery and the thread of the
conversation.”
—During the presentation of the book in Spain, a
writer that I greatly admire, Belen Gopegui, assured
that “in the darkest days and brightest ones, the
story told in this book will be there”. We Cubans
well know that this story will, in fact, live on.
And the book? Will this edition last, a book that
will soon be in the hands of Cubans?
—I would like the book to live on and give the
reader the possibility of approaching him more
intimately and more personally, approach Fidel
Castro. Someone who, being a very public figure, is
also very reserved. A timid person who doesn’t like
to talk about himself. The readers are going to
follow the conversation where he talks about
himself, although referring to international
politics, of the great politics and the Revolution.
When he refers to apparently foreign issues one
feels that he is, in fact, talking of himself, of
his views on essential processes in which he has
been involved.
“The importance of this book is this following, this
closeness to one of the most marked personalities of
the second half of the 20th century and
early 21st. A person who is not arrogant
and who often tries to reduce his own role; that
does not reduce him —quite the contrary—. Someone
who acknowledges that he has had doubts. Honestly, I
believe that the personality and true humanism of
Fidel Castro is reflected in this book.
Ignacio Ramonet
 Born in Redondela, Pontevedra (Galicia), on May 5, 1943 He is a doctor in Semiology and History of Culture and professor of Theory of Communication. He is a specialist in geopolitics and international strategy and UN consultant. Currently he offers classes in La Sorbonne, Paris. Since 1999 he directs Le Monde Diplomatique and Maniere de voir. He is also the cofounder of ATTAC and Media World Watch and one of the main promoters of the World Social Forum. He has published several books including,
La golosina visual (1985), Cómo nos venden la moto (with Noam Chomsky, 1995),
El pensamiento único (with Fabio Giovannini and Giovanna Ricoveri, 1996),
Un mundo sin rumbo (1997), Rebeldes, dioses y excluidos (with Mariano Aguirre, 1998),
Propagandas silenciosas (2002), Iraq, historia de un desastre (2004),
¿Qué es la globalización? (with Jean Ziegler, Joseph Stiglitz, Ha-Joon Chang, René Passet and Serge Halimi, 2004) and
Cien horas con Fidel (2006).
Juventud Rebelde 09-12-2006
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